so plagiarism has been on the menu of late, in christian circles anyways…
first up it was Mark Driscoll and various questions relating to work he copied or used from other sources… starting with a radio interview and then exploding into all sorts of articles and even some friendly tweets from ‘I kissed Rob Bell farewell’ tweetster, John Piper.
then David Rudd wrote this piece ‘In Defence of Plagiarism’ which referenced a recent occurrence of Rachel Held Evans work being plagiarised [the person later apologised] and Rachel jumped into the comments section of that to make it quite clear that she was not okay with people ‘stealing her work.’
various other celebrities and non celebrities jumped into the fray in different ways and forms and probably the best comment i have read in the whole conversation slash waging war was the one that said ‘the problem here is not plagiarism, it’s idolatry’ which resonates so closely with me – to me ‘christian celebrity’ is an oxymoron, or should be – any time we put anyone else on a pedestal that is not Jesus, we are bound for trouble soon. so maybe the problem here is not plagiarism, it’s celebrity? [runs and hides]
at the risk of being accused of plagiarising David Rudd, i should say that this will likely sound a lot like his, simply because i think to some extent i think the same thing, but i would love to air my two cents largely because i am just so bored and frustrated and ridiculoused out by all this online conversation and hopefully you have been able to miss the whole thing and so excuse my little rant.
i know this is not a popular opinion rant. especially among those who benefit off being the people able to call “Plagiarism.”
[and let me disclaim with the fact that i do feel that using someone else’s words and pretending they are your own is bad and silly and wrong and illegal for sure]
HOWEVER, my stance on this whole thing as far as i am concerned, is and always has been – if you want to use any of my stuff, go for it.
If it is Godly and worth using then i want as many people as possible to be reading what i write.
If it is all me and not worthwhile then i want as few people as possible to be reading it.
Problem solved.
And i have heard all the arguments and questions of ‘Oh yes, would you like someone to come and steal your car?’ and posturing and logic and so on, or it feels like i’ve heard them all – feel free to prove me wrong – but for me i have to ask what the heart of the writing is about?
If it is for the kingdom, then let go of the pride and the glory and the fame and the need for your name to be on the bottom of it and just celebrate that the kingdom is being preached.
And if it’s about making you look good, then at least be honest about it. Own the pride. Own the good feelings and identity and worthfulness you get from saving the world or transforming lives or whatever it is you are building up or breaking down. But just be honest.
My favourite book is a book called ‘No Compromise’ – the life story of a guy called Keith Green who i completely believe would be with me on this stuff – he used to infuriate ‘good, christian, musicians’ and worship leaders by giving his music away because, i don’t know, he believed [like i strongly, strongly do] that worship should be free. silly man.
i have written a book, which i do hope to somehow get published someday [called ‘I kissed hating [the church] goodbye’] and in the intro i pretty much disclaimed the likelihood of unintentional plagiarism in its covers simply because when i hear a good idea i often grab it and use it in a preach… and then after a while i have used it to often it suddenly starts to feel like it’s mine and i have no idea where it came from. can you imagine Jesus overhearing Paul referencing one of His parables and whispering down from heaven, ‘Hey Paul, don’t forget to mention you got that from Me?’ Nah, didn’t think so.
i love the notion of what Derek Webb has been able to do with Noisetrade in terms of music, where bands offer their music for free or a donation or even just a shout out – and so everyone has easy access to some great and often new music and there is the opportunity to pay-what-you-can or even to enjoy it for free but be telling others about it.
so, in summary:
taking someone’s stuff and pretending it is your own is bad [because i am such a not big fan of lying and that’s what that is, really]
writing stuff or creating art or music or poetry – be open-handed with it and let it get out there – why should just the rich and money-laden and privileged be able to get hold of your stuff
stop putting people on pedestals and christians, stop following the example and pattern of the world – we were called away from that. we can do so much better.
best worship song of the year? don’t get me started…
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Irresistibly Fish 
Brett, Thanks for your kind words. I don’t want to create “rules” for anyone else to follow, but I know for myself, I am learning to let go of as many things I think I deserve as possible. Truth is, I really deserve judgment and I’ve received grace instead. When I let that me my starting point, it changes the way I feel about things to which I am entitled.
I write a lot and when I do use other people’s work, I make sure to credit them with it. What’s interesting is that quite often you end up quoting another person, only to later discover that that piece of work has been around forever and it wasn’t actually written by the person you quoted. Truth be told, no one knows who wrote it and whoever did is probably dead and doesn’t care. But it still doesn’t justify making it so your own that other people quote you as having said it. I don’t mind people quoting what they read in my blogs, but it would be nice for them to simply credit me with it. I may smile when I open FB and find someone’s status is from my blog… I know where they’ve been! And it doesn’t really worry me if they don’t. No love lost. I once was asked to pitch some marketing radio ideas to a big supermarket chain in SA. I went with the best I had but never heard from them again. A couple of months later they rolled out MY idea on ANOTHER radio station. It happens. Live with it. Move on! http://www.helgavan.com
thankx Helgavan, yeah i am with you on the credit’ing – it is nice when people reference you but the marketing ideas part you mention is just straightforward stealing and that is not cool, especially in the professional context and so i can fully understand feeling aggrieved by that… but again in terms of the kingdom i guess how you respond to that [with undeserved grace and favour] points well to a loving and overgenerous God… thank you.
I’ll weigh in here with my two cents…
I love the idea of people being open handed with their creations, whether it be art, music, thoughts, ect. But it can’t be a precedent, and those who hold more tightly onto their creations shouldn’t be judged negatively for it.
I don’t think the problem is mainly pride. It more often than not would boil down to money, and that’s not bad in itself. If you’re musician, you’d probably love (and jump at) the opportunity of make a living out of your passion. If you’re an author, imagine the joy of being able to provide for your family through writing.
Making money off your creation is stifled when people try sell your work as their own (plagiarism) or take your work without paying for it or permission (piracy).
I am a musician and I truly don’t mind people sharing the music my band and I make. If the music I create will put a smile on your face and increase my band’s popularity, that means more to me than a sum of money. But if I were relying on album sales for a living, I might change my tune. I might not. I don’t know, but I do know that I can only make the decision for myself – just because I’m happy to share my music, doesn’t mean the artists I listen to should be happy to share theirs – especially if they rely on it for income.
I’ve only recently given up piracy, so it would be very hypocritical of me to have a piracy debate, but I’m more than happy to jump into the Kingdom debate.
In my very humble opinion, “if it is for the Kingdom”, isn’t a helpful way to judge things. Because the bible doesn’t seem to place distinctions between secular and non-secular work. It merely says in Colossians 3 that “Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for human masters, since you know that you will receive an inheritance from the Lord as a reward. It is the Lord Christ you are serving.”
Everything is for the Kingdom. Writing a worship song is for the Kingdom. Being a doctor is for the Kingdom. Delivering pizza is for the Kingdom. Sweeping the street is for the Kingdom. So if you follow Christ and have a paid for job, it’s for the Kingdom – if you’re expecting a doctor to be paid but a worship artist not to, then you’ve made a distinction the bible hasn’t.
So whilst it might feel strange that people could make money off Christian literature or worship music, the decision to make the work free should come from a personal conviction of the creator – it shouldn’t be expected.
Feel free to plagiarise this response. It was never meant to put food on the table…
thankx Simon, appreciate your thoughts on this – i think i would maybe personally distinguish between ‘spiritual’ and ‘for the kingdom’ – i would substitute what you said as ‘for the kingdom’ in your reply with ‘spiritual’ as in writing a worship song and delivering pizza – all of that is spiritual and should be done as unto the Lord – when i talk ‘for the kingdom’ i am talking specifically of trying to deliver a message linked specifically towards directing people to the kingdom so a preach or a worship song in that case might be different from delivering pizza [although the way you deliver pizza might lead someone to Jesus more than a good worship song in some cases] and what is unfortunate to me is when certain people [typically the poor or those without access to technology perhaps] are excluded from receiving a message or a song because there is a cost or because it is so difficult to transmit that song/preach to them cos it is being held so closely…
maybe the bigger question as an artist would be on the process where the musician/writer is typically getting so little of the money anyways that as that person you might like to see that system different which would then make the art a lot more affordable [Noisetrade etc] or systems where those with money pay more so that those without still get the opportunity to receive it – a tough one as i have been someone pretty strong on not pirating but hating the fact that i have to pay so much for something that costs so little to make… [and much appreciative of friends with dvd libraries of weird british and australian humour series that hold on to them loosely!]
but ja, i hear you and i think you make some good points – in some of the stuff i’ve seen online recently though there definitely seems to be a huge pride aspect [with certain people] which is tied up with the whole christian celebrity thing… and i do think both Jesus and Paul were quite vocal on the need for followers of Jesus to be set apart, different and distinctive from the rest of the world in the way we operate and live…
thankx again – always appreciate well thought out dialogue.
I think this is spot on:
“So whilst it might feel strange that people could make money off Christian literature or worship music, the decision to make the work free should come from a personal conviction of the creator – it shouldn’t be expected.”
My post, which is referenced, was more about how we respond when we find someone has stolen our material. I think there is room for us to appropriately pursue the avenues available to us while still being gracious.
I know I’m missing the point when I start thinking it is all about “me”. When my children were young, we sometimes had to outlaw the word, “mine” because it was clearly an outward expression of an inner attitude of selfishness.
Those who create (and I think that’s most of us) must walk a fine line between good stewardship, selfishness, and pride. Sometimes I get it right, sometimes I get it wrong.
It’s complex.
thankx David. i think from the context we are presently in that that statement makes absolute sense, but i guess i am questioning the context we are in and suggesting maybe this thing is a lot deeper than any of us are brave enough to touch right now… from a western privileged culture capitalism seems like a good idea and maybe even a Godly one… but when you start looking from the perspective of those who do not have BECAUSE those who have have so much or because we have a dumpster full of vegetables [like my boss posted on Facebook the other day walking to a restaurant we were going to have lunch at] etc then you realise maybe the system as a whole is flawed and broken… when i think of the early Acts church there is an idea that some would suggest looks like a working form of communism i guess – Acts 2.42-47 – no one was in need [and we know that model didn’t last all that long so was the model flawed or was it because people were involved and so invariably it went a little ‘off’? hard to tell] and if we were all tent-making like Paul was [and like Jesus and the disciples weren’t, so again not necessarily the model to follow but a good question perhaps] then perhaps we would have jobs that sustained us in terms of what we needed [another deeper question] and we could share all of our art, worship and teaching without having to pay for any of it… so can i say that it is definitely the Jesus’ way for worship/writing etc to be free? No, probably not. But it does feel strongly to me like it resembles that way a lot – free access to all… but from the perspective of a culture that operates on greed above need, we are going to have to dig deeper than ourselves and what we are comfortable with to find the answers to this… good conversation though…
Lots going on here in quite a complex debate, so this won’t be an adequate response, but maybe it’ll help unpack the conundrum..
I’m torn between whether the distinction between ‘spiritual’ and ‘for the Kingdom’ is helpful in this context. Whether we like it or not, we live in a society where most of us need to do some form of work in order to provide for ourselves and our loved ones. So whether Kingdom dynamics are at play or not, we work to provide. Fortunately the bible steps in before this concept can get too depressing, and it says that work is worship – so even if we are doing a job so we can get paid, we can still do it for a greater purpose than money.
So we could debate different expressions of society, but truth be told, the world has seen many civilizations rise and fall, and no-one seems to have a perfect economic structure. Capitalism might indeed be flawed, but it’s what we’ve got to operate in for now. And if that’s the case, then I’m not comfortable telling some people they can purse their passions as a paid-for career (doctor) and others they can’t (preacher).
If I’m a worship artist but I’m expected to give my music away for free, then I no longer can make worship music for a living. I’m forced to get a day job and constrain my writing to after hours – and these hours aren’t necessarily my best hours. They’re the hours I need to be with my family and friends, they’re the hours I need to do household chores, they’re the hours I have less energy, they’re limited hours. They’re not my best. Suddenly my passion doesn’t have my best.
Now I’ve quite obviously painted a picture which best suits my argument – in reality, there are plenty of people who produce great work as a hobby, but to stress my main initial point, the creator should be able to make these decisions. It’s unfair to have different rules for some professions and passions and different rules for others.
And yes it feels unfair that lots of people might lose out on some amazing work because they might not be able to afford it, but there will always be other amazing work that they can afford, that in some cases will be free. And the beauty of community is that we can legally share this work. I can lend you my copy of the book that recently inspired me, and you can lend me your copy of the album that’s inspiring you.
I’m excited for the system to change – for more work to be available for free or for less of the cost – but it’ll be a slow process. And the good news is that it’s already changing. People are getting creative. Whether it be the previously mentioned NoiseTrade offering music for free or a donation, or something like Netflix offering a whole bunch of good movies and series for a relatively small subscription fee – in an effort to decrease piracy, content providers are beginning to taper for the consumer on a tighter budget, so the whole market might indeed look incredibly different in 5 years time.
But until then, I still think it’s potentially unfair making the distinction that some people can get paid for their work, and others not. If you’re worried you have a friend that’s missing out, lend them a book, a CD, a DVD… rather let your conviction drive a change in the way you do things, than enforce it on people who might need to make money from their work now. If they truly on a walk with God, he will do any convicting that needs to be done.
I know this doesn’t touch on the whole ‘rich get richer’ side of things, but that’s more to do with social responsibility than creating distinctions between what you should or shouldn’t get paid for as a Christian. If your work is skyrocketing your income, you do have the God given responsibility to steward it well. You getting rich, should make others richer. But with most of these big life changing ideas, this will often need to be a God inspired conviction or revelation in someone’s life.
[And just a quick response to David, I think you’re totally right about responding to wrongs against you (whether it be plagiarism or a stolen parking spot) with the appropriate amount of grace. Our personal sense of justice often just leads to self entitlement, and when we start going down that path, pride will get the better of us.]